On 10/15/2021 at 12:43 PM, BruceMcF said:
In other words, you have a fundamental philosophical disagreement with this particular project,
The project has a disagreement with the project, I don't.
I'm looking at this and seeing it has something against FGPA, in fact doesn't seem to want them.
No, I have a fundamental philosophical disagreement with the 6502 if you need a religious war I'm on the Z-80 side of the battle.
I came here after noticing that the project I was ALREADY working on was similar in some ways to the 'dream computer' 8BG was on about and thought he might be interested, so I'm like, hey why don't I leave a note about it somewhere he may see it, you know, you don't go rushing up to a famous or busy person and demand their time, it's RUDE. Unless it's Jim Carrey and you need to tell him that you're his biggest fan and he'll appreciate it I'm sure. Next to the people who point at you, the famous person and go 'Oh, Oh, oh I know you from somewhere, I remember you you were in,, in, uhm it'll come to me..." and your like " I am (and say your own famous name) " and they're like "No, no that's not it, you're, you're uhm it's on the tip of my tongue" like you have no idea who you are of course.
So I figured to put it up
a note here given that is not a private subject, the project I'm working on will 'go live' and that cannot be stopped except by the ill-health of the designer I guess, so it's perhaps something of interest to a few. Well, how wrong I was,.. it seems that
someone got the thread locked, so that's the end of that.
Perhaps some juggling could squeeze the project I'm working on in under the $50 mark, such as a PS/2 keyboard socket instead of it's own keyboard which is used to program the totally blank memory rather than needing an EPROM programmer or micro-controller or so forth.It's a stand alone system, it's what a real computer looks like, rather than a patient at a computer hospital like so many other Z-80 projects that must be connected to the life-support serial terminal of a real computer to be able to gasp out text only and no GFX. What has the world of the once proud Z-80 come to ?
Hmm, maybe some fabulous plot by the 6502 community. We can imagine we have suspicions.
So the aims of the project I work on, if it were a bullet list on a video, would be a little different, but similar enough to warrant letting 8bg and others know about it, especially as it is ready to start prototyping some parts of it.
Easy to source parts, each part needs to be not just 'available' but it has to be available from many suppliers, you have to be able to run a search and find 10 or more suppliers or it's classed as a rare part and left out of the design. For example, a yamaha sound chip is something that would be supported as an accessory, it wouldn't be part of the main.
VGA minimum, however the target is SVGA or XGA / WXGA, yes, they do have clock-rates well above the Z80 and that appears to be no problem, the system clock won't even be 20Mhz, leaving room for overclockers who can source fast chips I guess. Yes, WXGA is a different aspect ratio to the others, and that is an issue, but one for programmers as you either have to choose an aspect ratio for the game (retro is 4:3) or program for selectable widescreen or just widescreen alone, up to the programmer. Yes, the pixels 'require a lot of writing' but there are innovative solutions in the display design that ease that burden considerably. The VHF section (not composite output, just talking speed here) is just that, VHF and we've been building such circuits longer than computers have been around and it's no massive insurmountable issue in any way. back to the bullet list..
Real parts.
Easy to understand parts except the CPU which is not too intimidating.
No added layer of abstraction in
FGPA.
Can run multiple operating systems and use many languages including what I want, which is a native version of
basic similar to AMOS Pro on the Amiga, So you want a box on the screen, you type box and the size, you want a circle, type circle and give co-ordinates and so on. Aiming for text languages is for other people who see it as an obvious platform for their work, cheap, capable and stand alone.
Affordable. The bill of materials (BOM) is looking at $70-90 at this time, with already $50 spent on the CPU and keyboard so far, but that eliminates the eprom programmer and the project eliminates a life support computer as well. It is looking to try to limit the need for test equipment too.
Quite frankly I cannot see any problem with any of these goals. In fact, I see no problem with the original dream computer list made up by the 8BG, because I saw no specification that an EPROM programmer was or was not needed, with the implication being the abbreviation of the keyboard ( which currently has about 300 parts ) down to a PS/2 socket and then people would use an adapter they can get at walmart for
double the price they can get it online, and whatever keyboard they choose. However, the project has a native keyboard which eliminates the need for a programmed chip altogether. You'd type in perhaps 200 characters and the computer will then fill in the rest in by itself from a printed page or your computer or phone.
So you see, I'm not a skeptic of the X-16, everyone else is ! I believe the 8BG's original design goals are achievable.